Do you think it’s fair of the mainstream media to basically attack this guy, a citizen, just because he was at a rally and asked a question to a candidate on camera…and was used as an example, rhetorically really, in the debate?
You think it’s ok for them to camp outside his house…call his boss…look up his taxes and other private information? I’m a former journalist mind you, so I know the technicalities of how these so called media types can do this sort of shit, but does that make it right? And if you don’t think Obama had anything to do with it, then why did he so feverishly meet McCain’s raising of Joe the Plumber in the debate.He looked directly into the camera to address Joe too. He must have felt that he owed Joe some kind of response (in order to diffuse McCain bringing it up to begin with). My husband nailed it…poor, poor Joe…he’s gonna be real sorry tomorrow he ever stepped foot near that guy (Obama). I know he is. I surely know he is. Hell, he might lose his job now over all this. Course, Obama will take care of him I’m sure.
The moment Obama decided to join in on the Joe the Plumber deal, the media was all over poor Joe like flies on shit. Seems to be a pattern there with Obama and the “mainstream” media. He raisies a cavalier eyebrow and they hop into action on his behalf. If Obama hadn’t said much in response to McCain’s ole Joe bit, the poor guy would probably be at work just telling stories about how Obama wants to take his money and give it to other people instead of making the rounds on news shows. It’s the Obama factor. Once you speak to him, you instantly become famous.
Did I mention I’m not only a reformed Democrat, but also a reformed journalist? I did? Ok, just wanted to make that clear.
mmc
No, I don’t think it’s fair that media has jumped all over this guy, but you say that everytime Obama raises an eyebrow they hop into action. Some examples? And it’s not fair to blame Obama when McCain was there too. You can’t blame Obama for the “what ifs.”
Carrie
And why, exactly, is it fair to blame Obama for the “mainstream media basically attacking this guy?” As I recall it was McCain who mentioned him in the first place. If “Poor Joe” is sorry about anything, it should be that McCain chose to mention his name. Could he not have made his point otherwise without dragging Joe into it?
http://faydean.typepad.com faydean
Well, McCain dragged Ole Joe into it because he was the one who finally got Obama to admit his agenda…redistribution of wealth. In that seemingly benign exchange, Obama let it all hang out…that he isn’t really concerned with Ole Joe’s success, he just wants his money so others can share in that success.
McCain had to jump on it. Any conservative worth a grain of salt would have.
If I had to give examples of how mainstream media is completely up Obama’s wazoo, then I’d have to stay up all night. You can’t be serious that you don’t believe most of the media backs Obama? Hell, he bought 30 minutes of airtime just so he could preach to his disciples. First time a candidate has done that in primetime…had the money to do that, even during the World Series.
Obama’s very smug attitude today at rallies about Joe just goes to show his disdain for the little guy. “How many plumbers you know that make $250,000?” What the fuck difference does it make? Is he implying a lowly plumber couldn’t possible make that kind if “rich” salary. Give me a break. He’s an elitist in sheep’s clothing.
Carrie
I think it’s a bit of a stretch to say that Joe the Plumber finally got Obama to admit his agenda. I believe the majority of his supporters (not disciples…) understand and accept his agenda and that is why they support him. The truth of the matter is that Joe doesn’t own his own business and he doesn’t make $250K and so he will be one of the 95% of Americans getting a tax cut under Obama’s plan. What if some day he does own his own business and makes over $250K?? Well, as mmc said, you can’t blame Obama for the “what if’s.” And while you may believe that Obama doesn’t care about the success of Joe, I don’t, for a second, believe that McCain does either.
Of course there are members of the media that back Obama. There are also members of the media that back McCain. Unfortunately, there are very few media outlets that are unbiased…but they are out there.
Just for clarification, do you happen to know what the sentences leading up to and directly after Obama’s question were? Or are you just projecting your beliefs onto that one sound byte? Because I, personally, have never gotten the impression that Obama is smug or elitist.
Kari-Mel
First let’s remember that the owner of this site is LEFT leaning, and to think that LEFT supporters would be here supporting HIM in HIS efforts to get Obama elected is not off in LEFT FIELD!
Second, I’m not suprised to see Faydean dropping the “f” bomb again because someone checked out old Joe the Plumber. Joe insinuated himself into this campaign. Was he doing so under the condition of anonymity? If he ( or any of us) has half a brain — we all must admit that there was no way anonymity was going to happen. He wanted his face out there. He wanted to be interviewed live on tv following the debate. He got his 15 minutes of fame and low and behold he got treated like he was famous — and his privacy was lost. Do you not recognize that’s how our media works in this country? To act like that wasn’t a probability or even a remote possibility is just silly. I don’t apologize for the media checking out the fact that 1) he isn’t even a licensed plumber (how the HELL is he going to own that business without a license?) 2) he has been voting REPUB for years 3) he owes back taxes so he’s not even an “upstanding citizen” who follows through with his current civic duty. It wouldn’t be hard to find out ANY of those 3 things — they’re all a matter of public record — so if you’re thinking his privacy was invaded, think again. Any old “Joe” off the street could find that out! But here’s the thing — had he been upstanding, licensed, forthright, and good for the Republican campaign — no one would be bitching. And that’s just proven by your rantings about how things are going.
Obama doesn’t show disdain for this guy, Fay. It’s a valid question — how many plumbers do YOU know who make $250,000? It makes a HUGE difference, not in that he was implying he was just a peasant — he was proving his point that IF he made less than that — his tax proposal wouldn’t affect him. But old Joe went and made like he was going to make assloads of money buying this business and be screwed. Seems he is already screwed, he’s practicing unlicensed, he’s not paying the taxes he already owes.….….what’s he really got to bitch about?
.….….crickets
.….….….……exactly!
Arguing with you, Fay, is funny. But I’m beginning to think you need to get your blood pressure checked. It looks like you’re about to explode while you type this stuff — you can see the pattern in every post. Your remind me of this one lady at work — she grasps at straws as soon as you say something positive about Obama — i.e. “his middle name’s Hussein so he’s a terrorist” She LITERALLY said that. Like HE chose his middle name or something. OR maybe he did, since he knew his birthdate and should have ordered his birth certificate BEFORE he was born.….….(recognize sarcasm here)
http://blog.meganhalpern.com mnmnj
@faydean:
I think there are a number of ways to tell Joe the plumber’s story, and I’m not sure that painting him as a victim, or painting the republican party as victims, does much good. Mccain has a habit going back 8 years of standing on a national stage and telling the country his “feelings have been hurt” by statements or ad campaigns during an election. It makes him look weak. It doesn’t help his campaign.
So, a simple comparison. Weeks ago, a left leaning guy in a deli asked Palin about Pakistan, and her answer was in opposition to McCain’s position. Yes, the guy who asked the question went on TV to talk about it. So did McCain and Palin. They called it “gotcha journalism.” Let’s say these events are equivalent in that sense. Both were questions from the public, asked by members who were out to hear something that they disagreed with. Why did Joe the Plumber end up all over the news? Let’s think about the contributing factors:
1. McCain mentioned Joe a couple dozen times in the debate, and elevated his status from citizen to archetype, claiming that Joe spoke for everyman. If Obama had held up a specific man or woman, pointed to them as the center of his platform, and told the country that they were the specific person he was fighting for, they might have been scrutinized, too.
2. Joe framed the question as a personal question. He used the word ‘I’ when asking Obama about his hypothetical situation.
3. There was a story there, in that Joe may or may not have misrepresented himself. Any type of scandal is good for the media.
4. Joe seemed, at least at first, to like the attention. He booked interviews with Couric, among others, and had his own little impromptu press conference.
In contrast, let’s look at the left leaning deli patron who also “happened to be there” and had a question to ask of a candidate.
1. The question was about foreign policy, it was not personal.
2. The Obama campaign didn’t make the citizen a centerpiece in the campaign
3. When interviewed, the citizen was articulate, and he raised a good point, but he was not as interesting as Joe.
It isn’t possible to point to one reason that these two instances were treated so differently. But I’m not sure that blame should be what we are after here.
As for the “left leaning media,” I am a grad student who studies communication. There is a theory about what is called the “hostile media effect.” The general idea is that whatever side you are on, you are likely to view the media as hostile toward you and supportive of the other side.
After reading study after study, I’m not inclined to judge whether or not the media, in general, has a bias. Certainly we can all agree that Fox News is conservative and MSNBC is liberal. Certainly NR is right wing and Atlantic Monthly is left. So what?
If Joe is in some kind of media induced hell, I truly feel for him, and I hope that his time in the spotlight is over soon. I suspect it will be, since the 24 hour news machine has a short attention span, and Joe didn’t really effect poll numbers.
If Joe is reveling in the attention, good for him. I had my 15 minutes for a show I produced in 2005. It was a blast.
But the central issue that Joe is supposed to stand for, the “gotcha” of Joe is a real political issue. One that deserves to be examined. Biden says it is patriotic to pay taxes, while McCain says that Obama is out to redistribute wealth. This is a real issue. One worth discussion.
I happen to believe that by paying 39% rather than %36 percent in taxes during tough economic times (brought on by foolish spending and irresponsible governing) IS patriotic. I don’t believe it will actually redistribute wealth so much as it will make the country stronger and more healthy.
Love is a verb. To love your country should be a verb. I hope that the Joes of this country don’t just love what they get from it, but love it enough to do something to help it. If you make more than $250,000 a year, maybe loving this country means wanting to help it escape from the hole it is now in. Maybe this country needs tough love. I think it needs to be put on a strict diet of oil and money; I think it needs major reform.
Joe seemed to be telling Obama that he would not vote for him if Obama would raise his taxes. That seems to me a narrow single issue. I hope that people who claim they love this country don’t vote based on such a selfish agenda. I hope that they vote based on who can help this country recover from the 8 year binge it has been on.
Timari
Thanks for those.
Stupidity never ceases to amaze me.….
Imagine us dumb Americans being concerned over such a silly thing 60 years ago…when Hitler, Mussolin, Stalin and Lenin existed. How silly of us. It could never happen again, surely, that a nation would be fooled by a sweet talkin’ guy selling us something that sounds too good to be true.
And then these many fools and ignorant types. Yes, they were all uneducated fools…
“A government policy to rob Peter to pay Paul can be assured of the support of Paul.“
George Bernard Shaw
“Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery.“
Winston Churchill
“The recurrence of periods of depression and mass unemployment has discredited capitalism in the opinion of injudicious people. Yet these events are not the outcome of the operation of the free market. They are on the contrary the result of well-intentioned but ill-advised government interference with the market.“
Ludwig von Mises
“The goal of socialism is communism.”
Vladimir Lenin
“Democracy extends the sphere of individual freedom; socialism restricts it. Democracy attaches all possible value to each man; socialism makes each man a mere agent, a mere number. Democracy and socialism have nothing in common but one word: equality. But notice the difference: while democracy seeks equality in liberty, socialism seeks equality in restraint and servitude.“
Alexis de Tocqueville
“Socialism values equality more than liberty but delivers neither.”
Dennis Prager
“To take from one, because it is thought that his own industry and that of his fathers has acquired too much, in order to spare others, who, or whose fathers have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association, ‘the guarantee to every one of a free exercise of his industry, and the fruits acquired by it.“
Thomas Jefferson
“Socialism is like a dream. Sooner or later you wake up to reality.”
Winston Churchill
“Socialism can only arrive by bicycle.”
Jose Antonio Viera Gallo
“The function of socialism is to raise suffering to a higher level.”
Norman Mailer
“Socialism in general has a record of failure so blatant that only an intellectual could ignore or evade it”
Thomas Sowell
“Under communist rule in the Soviet Union, the 3 percent of agricultural land that was privately farmed by people who kept part of the profits from their efforts supplied the majority of all farm produce. It is not simply that bureaucracy is inefficient. Any form of production that is not based on material reward will not operate efficiently.“
Steven E Plaut
“Socialism is the same as Communism, only better English”
George Bernard Shaw
“The Berlin Wall is the defining achievement of socialism”
George F. Will
“Socialism is the philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance and the gospel of envy.“
Winston Churchill
“How do you tell a Communist? Well, it’s someone who reads Marx and Lenin. And how do you tell an Anti-communist? It’s someone who understands Marx and Lenin.“
Ronald Reagan
“Collectivism doesn’t work because it’s based on a faulty economic premise. There is no such thing as a person’s ‘fair share’ of wealth. The gross national product is not a pizza that must be carefully divided because if I get too many slices, you have to eat the box. The economy is expandable and, in any practical sense, limitless.” — P.J. O’Rourke
“Socialism is the doctrine that man has no right to exist for his own sake, that his life and his work do not belong to him, but belong to society, that the only justification of his existence is his service to society, and that society may dispose of him in any way it pleases for the sake of whatever it deems to be its own tribal, collective good.“
Ayn Rand
“Government cannot make man richer, but it can make him poorer.“
Ludwig von Mises
“You can’t get rid of poverty by giving people money.“
P. J. O’Rourke
“A liberal is someone who feels a great debt to his fellow man, which debt he proposes to pay off with your money.“
G. Gordon Liddy
“Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron’s cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.“
C.S. Lewis
“The most fundamental fact about the ideas of the political left is that they do not work. Therefore we should not be surprised to find the left concentrated in institutions where ideas do not have to work in order to survive.“
Thomas Sowell
“You cannot bring prosperity by discouraging thrift.
You cannot help small men by tearing down big men.
You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong.
You cannot lift the wage earner by pulling down the wage payer.
You cannot help the poor man by destroying the rich.
You cannot keep out of trouble by spending more than your income.
You cannot further brotherhood of men by inciting class hatred.
You cannot establish security on borrowed money.
You cannot build character and courage by taking away man’s initiative and independence.
You cannot help men permanently by doing for them what they could and should do for themselves.“
Rev. William J. H. Boetcker
http://faydean.typepad.com faydean
Oh, and this
http://blog.meganhalpern.com mnmnj
@faydean
I understand that you are afraid of socialism, and I understand that you hate democrats and liberals.
I fail to see how any of that actually addresses what I wrote. Do you understand what taxes pay for? Taxes aren’t given to other citizens, they are used to pay for things the country needs. Like police. Like fire departments. Like unnecessary wars.
Calling a 3% increase in taxes socialism is extreme. I don’t believe you are stupid, or that you can’t distinguish between an increase in tax and actual socialism, so I don’t buy that your cold war propaganda movie and list of quotes is any kind of rebuttal.
http://faydean.typepad.com faydean
You’re right…I was being sarcastic for the most part. I understand about taxes, sure. I’m for them, if they’re used in the right way. But robbing Peter to pay Paul (cuz he can’t be bothered with working harder or longer or even working at all) isn’t my idea of what taxes should be used for.
Obama has said over and over that he will allow the Bush tax credits to expire…um, hello, now wouldn’t that automatically raise all those people’s taxes? Aghast, a politician skirting around the truth! Say it ain’t so. But like my husband always says, when you don’t tell someone something then it’s not lying…unless they ask, you’re not covering up. Hmm, perhaps like Joe the Plumber? (I hear spread the wealth in my head now as a ghostly whisper coming from some bygone era…say 1948).
Yes, yes it would raise those unsuspecting people’s taxes. He wouldn’t have time to do it this coming tax year, no. But next year…oh, next year won’t the grateful middle class be quite shocked when they open their tax booklets and find half their deductions and credits GONE!?
And I just love when Obama spouts off that 95 percent of tax payers figure, never recognizing the concrete number of about 40 percent in this country that don’t pay taxes AT ALL. You don’t think his intention is to give those people a check? Honestly? We just had a “conservative” (I think Bush is not only ignorant, but apparently has been mentally possessed some Democratic presidential ghost in the White House) give away money…just write a bunch of checks (with money borrowed from China no less) to people just to give them a little boost. Yup, I didn’t qualify for that boost needless to say. That was a little boost. Hell, I’d love to see what everyone who makes less than whatever golden number is chosen next time will get…and those who don’t pay at all (they DID get money back my dear…my own mother, who is on disability just had to fill out a tax form and voila instant ATM from the Fed. She hasn’t paid taxes in about seven years. She was very appreciative).
Politicians are liars. Democrats raises taxes. Conservatives used to cut taxes. I liked the distinct lines of the two parties (as they used to be). At least then I knew what I was getting. Now, you vote Republican and you end up owning stock in a bank as a taxpayer! All I have to say is that if this conservative president is backing stupid shit like taking over AIG and Fannie and Freddie, bailing out Wall Street and buying stock in banks, then when we get a Democratically run White House and Congress we are all screwed up the butt with our flagpoles!
And it will effect Joe the little guy, believe me. It always does. The Gov raises taxes on the rich, they raise prices of their goods and services to offset the increase (which YOU and I will pay) or they simply cut their work force. When businesses get taxed they don’t just suck it up and say, “Hey, this sucks…oh well, here’s my check.” Nope, they look at their bottom line and see where they can recup their loss…from US! Economics 101. Hell, in the last few months I’ve watched as my McDonald’s breakfast meal has gone up more than 30 cents! Hmm, I wonder if they just haphazardly decided one day to raise the price…“Hey, we haven’t raised prices lately…ya wanna? Sure, why not…our customers love our unhealthy products, they’ll pay whatever we charge.”
Nope. They were paying higher fuel bills and food prices…and hey, whadya know, they passed on their increased prices to Joe the Consumer. I paid it sure. But I wonder who decided they couldn’t stop by Mickey D’s as often and cut back to just two times a week versus four. For every one of those customers, who decided to pinch a penny here and there because of the price increase, that translates to millions of dollars for McDonalds. So now McDonald’s is paying more for their supplies and overhead and lost revenue because they had to pass it on to consumers, who were already getting pinched from all the other businesses passing on their losses to them already. Add in a business tax to make them and you just add to the problem.
Across the board, last year, we saw in our family a surcharge for fuel and increased operation costs from our utilities, our bug guy, our landscaper, the people who groom our dog and people who did some contractor work for us. They all were paying more, so they charged us more. See my point? Taxes don’t fix an already pinched economy! And those surcharges were ones we knew about on really non-essential things that we could already afford. But imagine the hidden increases people are paying now on things they must have and need. It’s like the ole bait and switch on people with the “we pay the sales tax” gimmicks you see. Um, yeah, some business is just charitable in their heart…they’re gonna suck up the sales tax on their goods just to get you to buy from them. Uh huh, and I’ve got some real estate in the Everglades I’d like to seel you too. No, they just include the sales tax normally due into their price! You don’t save shit. But it sure sounds nice, don’t it.
You’d be naive to think that sticking it to the rich people is gonna help you or anyone worse off than you. It trickles down all right…like piss rolling down you back.
Like I’ve said before, I give it six months…no, a year, before Obama’s golden spotlight begins to flicker and people start saying, “Hey…wasn’t he gonna fix all this mess…help us…give us MORE?” That’s when I will sit back, cross my feet and sip my coffee and say, “Uh huh, who’s your Obama now baby?”
Make no mistake, we will be screwed. How badly just depends on how much power the Gang of Three have.
http://faydean.typepad.com faydean
In a serious spirit of expanding one’s thoughts…
dross
mnmnj,
I don’t see anything faydean wrote that would lead you to believe she hates people who happen to be Democrats and/or liberal. BTW, the term liberal has been hijacked by people who aren’t liberal at all. What’a a liberal? Certainly the definition is different than it used to be. I think drugs should be legal, I think prostitution should be legal, I think all activities between consenting adults should be their business an no one else’s. I think gay folks should be able to legally bind themselves to each other, the same as straight folks. I’m against the death penalty, against three strikes laws, and I’m against inserting religion into the government anywhere. I’m also for the war in Iraq, against government intervention in commerce (again, free transactions between consenting adults) and against government favoring one race over another. So am I a liberal or a conservative?
I don’t know about faydean, but I definitely fear Socialism. It’s a destructive and dangerous political philosophy that operates through oppression. Is one tax increase socialism? No, but every raise of tax rates is a step closer. Taxing the top earners and giving money to lower level earners is income redistribution, period.
Whenever taxes come up, the left trots out police, firemen, roads and bridges. Yes, taxes pay for firefighters and police. Those are local taxes, not federal. Yes, it makes sense for federal taxes to pay for highways. Many, many other programs are simply taking away from one constituency and giving to another. That’s income redistribution, too.
It’s fundamentally unfair to ask one percent of the population to pay for 40% of the country’s tab. It’s fundamentally unfair for 50% of the country to pay only 3% of the tab. George Bush increased the number of people paying nothing, and Obama would increase it further and go the extra step of giving money to many who don’t pay taxes and calling it a tax cut. These are steps further into socialism.
Obama acknowledged in a debate with Clinton that raising the capital gains tax can reduce the amount of taxes collected from that tax. He argued for increase regardless, because he says it’s more “fair.” That position is pure socialism.
Every candidate says things. Every candidate does things. From which do we learn more? Obama talks mostly like a moderate. He acts like a socialist. I believe his actions.
http://blurbomat.com blurb
@dross, I find the name calling bordering on humorous. That’s all you got?
“income redistribution”. Oh that I lived in your non-gray world.
I find the charges of socialism coming from a man who voted affirmative to give the treasury the ability to nationalize banks to be the epitome of hypocrisy and desperation.
http://faydean.typepad.com faydean
Jon,
If you are speaking of McCain, please site such a vote.
McCain is not being desperate, he is calling a spade a spade. When you take money from one group to give more money to another group, that IS income redistribution, bottom line.
McCain’s vote can be seen on the Senate website here.
Nice racist usage of the word “spade”.
Ok, I’ll give you the income redistribution. But that’s been happening as long as we’ve paid taxes… the irony here is that under GOP control, “income redistribution” has gone to the rich and educated who can hire people to game the tax system so as to reduce their tax burden.
The page is shaky, without proper citations, I know.
http://blog.meganhalpern.com mnmnj
so I guess the point for me is that no sooner does the public reject one boogieman to scare us away from Obama, another one rises up in its place. First it was Muslim, then terrorist, now socialist. Not one of these titles is thoughtful or nuanced. Not one of them help us “know who Barack Obama really is.” They don’t help us evaluate his policies, or his actions. Just like McCain’s economic plan, they are hatchets, not scalpels.
No, mnmnj…Obama is not one of those things. He’s ALL of those things.
http://faydean.typepad.com faydean
Jon,
Where does one begin to argue with the absurdity that is income redistribution? Well, let’s start with the principle of the matter. Why, exactly, does anyone owe anybody anything? And please don’t give me that fuzzy, fairytale liberal stance on how we must help our fellow man.
Why should my husband, a doctor, who spent 23 out of his 35 years studying and training for his profession give his money to someone who either did not pursue an education for himself, work a job that has no way for advancement, make poor choices, or, gasp, not even work at all?
I really want you to tell me why my husband, who has worked hours most people couldn’t even fathom, doing work they can’t even imagine in terms of stress (keeping people alive sort of involves that) owes anything more to anyone else? His work already gives as much from him personally as any “job” could. He’s dedicated more than half his life pursuing it. And despite what your perception is, medicine does help people who don’t have alot, if anything. He’s spent more time helping those of low income and no insurance in his profession than any government official EVER has.
I’d like you to give me an example, besides your standard liberal vision, of someone YOU know personally who is being kept down or suffering in some economic way due to those “horrible” rich people of the world. Can you give me a personal story of someone being kept down by the evil corporations and business people of the world? Because I can give you at least a dozen examples of people on the dole that are being kept down by your beloved government, whether you think they are or not…people who neither need to be on government assistance or deserve to be.
Government welfare or entitlements do not help anyone be able to pull himself up by the bootstraps. Often times when you give someone “assistance” , he doesn’t just take it, thank you kindly for your help and then use that boost to himself up and move on to better things. Nope, more often than not, the person will take the help, tell you that you owed it to him anyway and then turn around and ask for more.
It’s a Pavlovian response…
If you make a mouse run a maze, exert himself to get food he WILL work to get it. But, if you show him the option of just pushing a button and letting it fall at his feet, he will push the button. The path of least resistance. Despite what you might argue Jon, environment is not the only determination of one’s lot in life. There is a matter of choice there. And with choice, there is required determination and perserverence.
Good gravy, I’m glad our founding fathers weren’t of the ilk of today’s gimme me what I deserve mentality. Can you imagine? We’d have gotten shit to nowhere on building this country if they’d sat around whining about all the hard work, hunger, danger and effort! How it was so unfair they had to do things they didn’t like or feel like doing. I can see the pioneers who expanded this nation balking now, “This is too hard…the road is bumpy, it’s dirty out here and scary, I’m tired, I don’t wanna chop wood or clear fields. Someone carry me.” Gimme me an effin’ break!
That’s what this nation has lost, in HUGE abundance. We are no longer a nation of do what we can…pitch in and help…do your best and the rest will abide. Nope, we are a nation of this is too haaard and I don’t waaaanna. HEEELLLP.
My husband has worked his ass off to get where he is, finally earning a decent living in his mid 30s to support his family. We’ve worked hard together to get here. And we WORK hard and will continue to work hard. Nope, it’s not easy. And it ain’t fair. No one every said it would be, or SHOULD be. If they did, then they just wanted what they didn’t have. There is a victim mentality running rampant in this country, and it will eventually undermine all the hard work and effort of every man, woman and child that came before and didn’t expect to be given whatever they needed or wanted.
The great Thomas Jefferson once said:
“To take from one, because it is thought that his own industry and that of his fathers has acquired too much, in order to spare others, who, or whose fathers have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association, ‘the guarantee to every one of a free exercise of his industry, and the fruits acquired by it.”
You know Jon, you’re right, he was just a greedy ole bastard. And his face is plastered on the EVIL money too.
faydean: Show me non-partisan essays about the economic plans. The Heritage Foundation is a well-known conservative group.
Farmers get subsidies from the government. Corporations get subsidies. Including oil companies.
Here’s your problem: Democrats are going to win in this election. It’s looking like McCain’s negative campaigning (and that of his surrogates) are biting him in the ass. Your arguments don’t reflect The Reality. They reflect Your Reality; reality as you hope it is. You’ve not responded to any of the reality that people in these threads have shared, except to continue preaching your reality. I’ve shared factual links, not always from liberal sources.
Your husband isn’t being asked to give his money away. WE ALL ARE. And the money we give doesn’t just go to crackheads and lazypants. It builds roads. It builds schools. It pays teachers, cops, soldiers and fire fighters. Taxes are not evil. Sharing isn’t evil.
Acting petulant and aristocratic isn’t going to move us forward. Will there be missteps? Hell yes. But we’ve got a long way to go to fix things. And all the B.S. flying in this campaign isn’t going to help.
I’m going to close comments on this post. Thanks everybody for participating on this thread.
