How I Do
December 20th, 2007Several of you have made the request over the years that I share my perspectives on living with someone who has chronic depression. I’ve been reluctant to share for many reasons. The biggest reason I haven’t is that part of living with someone who can spiral downward and inward means that I have to be careful about what I say and do. If the fire is raging, you don’t throw fuel on it or add gunpowder to it. Day to day, I’m probably being overly cautious. During stressful times of the year or during stressful events, those days where I need to be careful are more frequent. It seems like we’ve barely been able to catch our breath until very recently and now it is holiday season. Which, as you are aware, contains no stress at all.
Fixing It by Not Fixing It
As a heterosexual man attracted to a woman, I have a range of emotions and ways of dealing with whatever life throws my way. One of those things is to look at a problem and want to fix it. Men like to be fixers, for the most part, and this is great for things like a clogged drain or dead car battery. Also great if the satellite dish isn’t picking up the latest “Nature is Sad” show on the educational channel because it’s buried in snow. It is not so great if your partner needs for you to help her by listening.
I’m not certain this is entirely gender-related, as I’m certain it is just as likely that a woman can be a fixer as well. It just keeps coming up for me that I can’t fix it and I need to shut up and listen. Almost two years ago, Leah Crawford interviewed me for her site, Leahpeah and asked me how Heather’s illness had affected my life. I wrote then that people in relationships, particularly the man, often have a strong desire to fix things. What I neglected to say then is that one of the best ways to help somebody is to shut up and listen. This is extraordinarily difficult for me as a talker. I’ve really had to stop myself and let it go. I have to tell myself that I need to LISTEN and to tell myself to SHUT UP. It’s doubly important when somebody is anxious or depressed and needs to get it out. I have only met a few men who are great listeners, and those were professionals I was paying to listen.
So. Listen.
Stress Management & Meds
In our case, Heather handles stress very differently than most people I know. She is a master internalizer and the whiff of brooding energy she emits outward is usually an indication that there is a much larger inner storm raging. I’ll usually try to get a calm moment when just the two of us can talk and I’ll have to ask her about five or six times if something is wrong or if she needs to talk. Having lived with her for awhile now, I can say that I can see this coming a few days off. Especially given some of the big things we’ve done in the past two years. Starting a business, selling our house by ourselves, moving, her projects, professional and occupational stress, etc. have all proven to be major stressors. I view my role as to simultaneously get things done and listen when called upon. I don’t regret this role, and I don’t begrudge it. I view every conversation as a chance to learn something new. And a chance for me to tell myself to listen.
As part of intense stress periods, I always have to ask, sometimes repeatedly, about medication levels. The professionals who successfully treated Heather for post-partum depression came up with a drug cocktail that saved Heather’s life. It’s my job to help her stay on those meds and help her assess whether or not they are working like they did in 2004. This will be an ongoing thing for the rest of her life. There are good days around the prescription discussion and not so good days. As with all chronic medication consumption, it is only natural to assume that one feels better and can taper off the meds. There have been several instances where I’ve noticed a higher state of anxiety and a certain tone in conversation, a withdrawal or unusual comment from Heather and felt the need to bring up medication as a state of emergency. Luckily, Heather responds and if she has changed her dosage, after we discuss (sometimes more pointedly than others) she takes it back to the levels that were prescribed. When the meds kick in, it’s like I’m living with the Heather who can cope and get through life. If she’s changed her meds, it’s not pretty. The stress on me during these times builds and builds. I have to be careful in how I release that stress. I also have to make time for me. I have had to learn that most of what is bothering Heather has nothing to do with me or our relationship. It has to do with her internalizing stress and how she deals with life when it gets overwhelming. To be sure, there are those times when I’ve done something wrong or I’m not doing enough or I’m caught up in a project and it causes friction. Just like every other relationship.
Our life is such that we must become adept at crisis management. Home ownership, parenthood and business ownership means that things are going to happen, sometimes all at once. I have to be in a good place to have a clear head to deal with whatever life is going to throw at me. This is not easy. I do a lot of self talk (sometimes freaking Heather out) to either practice conversations I need to have or help me work through a situation. I also have to be strong and assertive most of the time or else I’ll be blown over by the power of the illness.
I have to have a good amount of sleep to face the next day. I get this by taking an antihistamine that helps me sleep and dries out my perpetually runny nose. Side effect: used to be prescribed as a mild anti-depressant. Getting enough sleep makes it so much easier to listen and/or take over if Heather can’t function.
As far as I’m concerned, I’m always open to trying medication if I think I need it. Heather has suggested I try a few things in the past, but I’ve so far not had a steady course of anti-depressants. Typically, getting enough sleep, changing my life (sometimes with talk therapy) and managing my stress have helped me through the hardest of times. If I’m being a jerk, no medication is going to fix that. I have to recognize I’m being a jerk and work on it. I think everybody on the planet goes through jerk phases and being aware is the beginning to living a life that is less difficult on those around us.
Openness Leads to Success
I have to be open. Being raised as I was and given my own propensities, this is extremely difficult for me. I have admired Heather’s openness and willingness to share, but there is always that part of me that worries if there will be a cost later. I can’t decide if I was meant to be a risk management assessor, tin foil proponent or character in either an E.M. Forster or M. Somerset Maugham novel.
Talk therapy has been something that has saved me, saved my relationship with Heather and made our lives together stronger. It is hard work and difficult to hear and learn things about oneself, but I believe that every single person on the planet would benefit from talk therapy. Maybe one doesn’t need it all the time, but I view it as something that I can turn to and use to help navigate through life. I don’t think that because I’m living with Heather, I’ll do more therapy because of her illness. I need it for myself and together, we’ll need it for our relationship. It’s not weak or lame to face ones issues. It’s not strong to live in denial. It’s not strong to live in fear of talking about the dynamics of how we process life events or why we react the way we do. I only wish I had sought therapy after my father died and that in my first marriage, I had sought therapy earlier. I’m not sure that my life would be different, but perhaps better. I’m very happy now, and I love where I am, both professionally and personally. Most importantly, for Leta, I love where we are. She needs happy and healthy parents.
As with any chronic illness, any form of treatment needs to be done carefully and with supervision from professionals. I can’t stress enough how lucky we have been to have had doctors willing to try certain combinations of medicines. We’ve taken it into our own hands in the past and sought different doctors when it was clear that Heather was responding to medicine or a particular doctor has a propensity for a certain diagnosis or treatment that wasn’t helping. The saddest part of treating depression is that most doctors want to ramp up the medicine (for good reason) and it’s very difficult to see a response sometimes. I wish there were a better way to deliver a clinical dosage of meds on an outpatient basis. Most of my experience in this area comes from watching Heather start a medicine for a few weeks and have it either make her worse or have no effect. In order to deliver the dosage and right cocktail, Heather had to be in a hospital/facility where she could be monitored. There was no ramping up. And that is exactly what Heather needed.
One of the biggest and most detrimental side effects to being a partner of someone with a mental illness is that there is the impulse to not share the hard stuff with them for fear they can’t handle it. Likely corollary to that is that the disease is a part of our relationship, meaning it needs its own space. The meds and therapy continue to help, but the disease is always there. I have to be aware of those times where nearly every exchange, every gesture and every non-verbal cue is related to the illness in some way. This adds a burden to any relationship and ours is no different. One of the hardest things to write, is that Heather’s illness means that sometimes she can’t be there for me in a way that I need her to be. I learned this early on, but I still have a hard time making room in our relationship for the largest side effect on me of her illness. It’s not maliciousness on her part. It’s not ignorance. It’s that the disease is all-consuming. I do stand up for myself and I have to be more verbal than I’ve ever been about stating clearly that I need her or I’m having a rough day. Fortunately, those times are fewer as things have smoothed out career-wise and I’ve learned how to tell her that I’m struggling or I need to talk.
In every relationship there is work to be done. There is no such thing as a perfect relationship. There are people who are likely to be better suited for one another, but there is no magic. While this post might sound like it’s not worth it or that Heather and I are having problems, I should clarify that it’s not like that. If I didn’t care about Heather, or wasn’t willing to do the work that a relationship demands, I’d be worse off in my life. Living with Heather is worth it. I’m in love with her and willing. I feel that she shares this feeling about me and that makes all of this so much easier to live with and deal with. In my past, I’ve shied away from doing the hard work in a relationship and in looking back using talk-therapy and a few great therapists, I’ve been able to see that my own laziness and unwillingness to work has harmed myself and others. I’d be a fool if I didn’t take what I’ve learned from therapy and apply it to the best relationship I’ve ever known.
Get Help
To the people out there who denigrate mental health awareness and treatment, I say this: You aren’t helping. You are making it worse. Stop being an arrogant know-it-all. You aren’t right. You are wrong. If someone tells you they need help, your opinion means less than that of professionals. Stop being ignorant. Stop being obstinate. Stop insisting that your loved one, partner, child or co-worker “get over it”. They won’t get over it until you let it go and encourage them to seek help. There are many different approaches and ways to treat mental diseases and conditions. The first step is letting go. You could probably use some time talking it out yourself. o
Tags: depression, essay, stress, therapy
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December 21st, 2007 at 1:35 pm
Thank you so much for this post. My boyfriend is struggling with depression and reading your post has made me feel more confident in my decision to seek therapy myself.
December 21st, 2007 at 1:46 pm
The next time I have a conversation with a newly engaged woman is showing off the carats in her diamond ring, I will ask her to read two things before she makes that commitment: this post, and Heather’s post about her first postnatal poop.
Because the man you marry should be the man who believes you are that worth it.
I’m not talking pedestal placement or idol worship. I’m talking about that honest depth of partnership that only comes when someone loves you so much, they work to be a better person. The one you mary is the one who will shovel your shit sometimes (both literally and figuratively), not because they’re martyrs, but because you’re on the same team. That is what partnership is.
(And please print a copy of that comment from Patsy and burn it. Anyone who even subtly suggests that someone who lives with a mental illness shouldn’t be allowed to raise children, is so, so, so out of touch with their own mental health, that we simply must cleanse ourselves from the poison the spit in their quest for for their own stability. )
December 21st, 2007 at 1:47 pm
Just wow. I, yet again, applaud you and Heather on your willingness to share and document. You all rock!
December 21st, 2007 at 2:08 pm
I missed the post by “pasty” last night. I don’t want to defend her but offer another perspective. I too have wondered how Leta can be left alone with Heather and how either parent could willingly bring another child into the home. My husband suffers from PTSD (several deployments to Iraq) but I never leave my 4 young children alone with him because you just never know. I also read and wonder why Leta is not in intensive therapy for her serious delays. Then one day you might catch about half a sentence that refers to Leta being tested and so on and so forth. Which tells me no one can read anything online and assume you know the whole story so whether the intent is to be hateful, helpful, or just plain nosy the whole story is never told and without knowing the whole story you really can not make any assumptions. Besides, I have 4 of my own to screw up and try to leave others to screw up their kids as they see fit! LOL!
December 21st, 2007 at 2:12 pm
Wow, I didn’t even see Patsy’s post until Yolanda mentioned it and I had to go find it.
Patsy, it is people like you that cause the stigma of mental illness to spread like wildfire. Your opinion is based on lack of education or experience in this department.
My question for the Patsy’s of this world is this: Do you have diabetes? Are you at risk for any cancer or heart disease? Are you overweight, out of shape, a smoker or drinker? Are you human? Do you have issues like everyone else in this world? Would you ever, ever consider not having kids because of any of these issues? The reason I ask is because any mother or father can, at any time in their life, for any reason or even no reason at all, be a bad parent. Mental illness does not the bad parent make, oh no. Intolerance and ignorance make a bad parent.
I am deeply offended that you compare Heather to Andrea Yates. The biggest glaring difference between the two women is that when Heather reaches out for help and support, she gets it. Andrea didn’t-her pleas for help were ignored. She was told to “get over it.” She was faced with the harshest side of the mental illness stigma. She was surrounded by people like you.
I also just want to say that every mother on this planet deals with frustration and anger over their children. Anyone who says otherwise, who says that their kids are perfect, loving angels 24/7 is a flat out liar. Kudos a million times over for Heather and Jon’s gutsy openness and honesty!
Now I gotta go…Mama needs vodka!
December 21st, 2007 at 2:24 pm
How lucky you both are to have each other.
And Leta is the luckiest.
December 21st, 2007 at 2:45 pm
Thank you and thanks to Heather, too!
I think that it’s very important for people with depression to know what it’s like for others, and your words meant a lot to me.
I totally agree with you about listening - Listening is one of the most difficult things to do, but that’s what really helps..
I’ve been suffering from panic attacks, anxiety and depression for several years. My husband has been wonderful and very supportive. I sent him your post because sometimes I feel that having to cope with my illness is taking his toll on him and I’m sure he’ll find comfort in reading about your experience.
Again, thanks for sharing to both you and Heather.
I wish you, Heather and Leta (and Chuck!) a very Merry Christmas and a wonderful New Year.
December 21st, 2007 at 3:04 pm
Wow. You guys have the real thing, and I am so happy for you and Heather. I am so glad you wrote this. The best of everything to you and Heather now and always.
December 21st, 2007 at 3:14 pm
Jon,
The best things in life are those we have to work hard to get. Sometimes we take such things for granted and don’t realize their value until later, when it’s too late.
I wonder if, in many ways, your relationship is made stronger and more full by the illness? I’d be willing to bet that is the case. I’m sure you agree.
More posts like this! More! More! More!
December 21st, 2007 at 3:15 pm
@ Sarah: Well, if you’re going to go there, why do YOU stay with a man with PTSD, never mind leave your kids alone with him?
I understand you’re not trying to be a jerk, but I think it’s disingenuous for you to talk about “safety” for your kids when you could be putting yourself in harm’s way as well. I mean, if this man could be in any way dangerous like you fear, what kind of example are you setting for them?
December 21st, 2007 at 3:43 pm
A wonderful, thoughtful post. Thank you for sharing the spousal perspective.
December 21st, 2007 at 4:17 pm
Wonderful blog about how to shut up and listen
I’m sending this to my partner, as I deal with on-again off-again depression.
December 21st, 2007 at 4:18 pm
Jon,
You are quite amazing! It’s not often you find a man brave enough and open enough to allow for himself an authentic, loving relationship. I loved your post and the way you talked about yourself and your role as a husband and father. The planet could handle about a billion more men just like you!
December 21st, 2007 at 5:27 pm
@Broad, like I said unless the entire story is shared you do not know it.
December 21st, 2007 at 6:03 pm
Wow. You are awesome. When my ex husband asked for a divorce, he wouldn’t tell me why, and I later learned through a mutual friend that it was because I was depressed. I too suffer from chronic depression. And it’s wonderful to see that there are indeed wonderful people out there who are willing and able to deal with it in their partner.
December 21st, 2007 at 7:18 pm
First off, a great post. Honest, and nailed it, I think. I’m a 40-year-old woman who wrestles with chronic anxiety and depression when stress reaches a certain level. I have taken anti-depressants, different ones, for almost 10 years, and have gotten myself down to a small level that allows me to avoid crappy side effects like weight gain and loss of libido and still stay sane.
Now, I will back up Patsy with this piece about myself: After I felt suicidal for the second time in my life (early 30s) and “gave in” to taking medication, I looked at the genetic predisposition of depression and bi-polar disorder in my family, and assessed the rage and self-imposed isolation I feel when depressed, and I made a choice to get my tubes tied. I based my decision on these reasons:
1. Clearly, I needed to take anti-depressants on some level for the rest of my life. What would be the health risk to a fetus?
2. What if I stopped the meds to breastfeed (which would have been very important to me) and fell into a post-partum depression in which I resented my baby, or worse, HURT her in a fit of aggression (which was a big component of my depression).
3. What if I passed this disease on to my child and one day, as a teen, she tried to commit suicide like I tried? How could I knowingly take a chance on passing this on to my child in her DNA? The pain and guilt of such a situation would, I think, have killed me.
So, there are people who consider the points that Patsy raises and understands what it is that she is trying to get at.
Clearly, Heather and Jon adore Leta. Reading the love in Heather’s monthly newsletters makes me especially sad that I will not experience such a love with my husband. But I did what I felt was right for me and was thinking of the child too.
P.S. If I ever adopt a child and he or she is depressed, I know I’ll be mentally stable enough with the help of anti-depressants, and with my husband’s support, to handle it. And if that depression led to heartbreaking times, yes, I would suffer. But I wouldn’t suffer guilt thinking that *I* was the one who gave my child the disease. Hope this makes sense and gives another perspective.
December 21st, 2007 at 7:24 pm
Sorry, also meant to add that my choice bears no judgment on Heather and Jon’s decision to have a family. Those familiar with depression know that it’s important to know what your key stressors and emotional deal-breakers are, in order to best cope. For me, the anxiety of “what if” regarding getting pregnant and having a child while on antidepressants was too great. If I were an anxious mother, I’d be an angry, depressed mother. And everyone in the family would suffer, period.
December 21st, 2007 at 8:23 pm
Great post. I’ve felt very alone over the past five years in living with my spouse who suffers from anxiety and depression. I enjoyed how you humanized the experience of loving someone, while still having to cope with the essence of who they are.
December 21st, 2007 at 9:33 pm
Excellent post Jon, thanks for sharing something so personal.
December 21st, 2007 at 9:43 pm
How about when you are chronically depressed person (the mom) living with the another chronically depressed person (the (age 22) adult daughter)? As someone who has accepted that I should take meds - and it’s no different than medicating diabetes or high blood pressure - I still find myself slipping off the meds (forgetting or shrugging them off…I don’t need ‘em now, do I?) and then discovering that damn! I really need them _now_ because the other depressed person hasn’t learned to accept it and she is 20 times worse and rubs me the wrong way. Instead of sypathizing with her, I find myself wanting to scream at her…”Do yourself in already and stop with the empty threats!!! I am too depressed to deal with you! Don’t I have enough to deal with — without you dragging me down, too?” How awful is that? I am her mom! She really needs me - I’m the only one who truly understands her what she needs to calm down (constant repeating to her that it’s ok, that she is taking things too personally, that it’s not worth the energy she loses over the particular agony of the moment, that it will pass, repeat, repeat, repeat and rub the back) but I don’t always get through to her. So it’s important for me to stay on track or she really goes off track. Eh…this is hard to explain without run on sentences. But it feels better putting it down here. So moral of the story…take the damn meds and stop taking everything so personally!
December 21st, 2007 at 9:50 pm
p.s. Usually just letting her talk and talk helps,too…so you are right! Just listen and nod sympathetically (real sympathy). Eh…this is too hard to explain…but I’m thinking every here gets it!
December 21st, 2007 at 10:01 pm
Wow. This was a beatifully written and wonderful post. We should all be so honest, with ourselves and with each other.
Patsy: Really? Did you really just imply that Heather is or could be in some way like Andrea Yates? That she could kill her children? Really? Because she sought help for her depression, that can be out of control wothout treatment? Really? I must assume that you know her in person and know something that no one out here on the internet knows, to publicly make such a comment. A few things about mental illness:
1. It doesn’t make you killer
2. It doesn’t warp your children
3. It doesn’t and shouldn’t exclude you from the gene pool
I am a lesbian and I shudder to think of the amount of people who figure I shouldn’t have reproduced. I am also in recvery from my own mental illness, as I was severely depressed after birth. I also have AD/HD and a few other things about me that I am not brave enough to post publicly. My son is affectionate, smart, developmentally on target and well adjusted, even in this mentally ill lesbian household.
You should really think before you start leveling judgement against people who are making it in what sounds like a home that is full of laughter, chaos, creativity, frustration, tears and LOVE. REALLY.
December 21st, 2007 at 10:18 pm
“One of the biggest and most detrimental side effects to being a partner of someone with a mental illness is that there is the impulse to not share the hard stuff with them for fear they can’t handle it.”
I have depression, and that’s a problem that I also have. I worry that other people can’t handle the hard times I feel.
I also tend to say a lot when I’m upset, I talk about things that bother me, that I hadn’t realized until that moment that they bothered me so much. I’m obviously not very in touch with my emotions; in fact, my emotions terrify me, and I like to run from them as often as possible, because I experience a lot of sad emotions and I *hate* crying (in public or otherwise). I know it’s wrong, but I feel that crying is a manipulation tactic and a sign of weakness (things told to me by my parents). Sadly, I’m someone that cries at the drop of a hat, and I honestly cannot control it. I wish I could, or I would never cry.
It’s really hard to convince someone that you understand their need to be alone when you’re crying. To be honest, I *do* understand the need to be alone (because I, myself, experience that need almost daily). It still makes me feel sad, excluded and a bit lonely, though, when other people need their “me” time. Just because I understand that they need their alone time (and am willing to allow it to them), doesn’t mean it doesn’t hurt my feelings a little bit. Logistically, I realize it has *nothing* to do with *me* personally, it’s just something we all need, but it still hurts a bit all the same.
I suck at talking with my therapist, though. I’d like to switch therapists, but our family isn’t the “go from doctor to doctor ’till you find one that works” type, and I’m afraid of hurting my therapist’s feelings.
I was raised with a mother who has borderline personality disorder on top of depression. Because of this, I’ve learned to put other people’s feelings before mine. The ironic part? I suck at social skills and tend to insult people without realizing it, and thus unintentionally hurt other people’s feelings. Things that I feel are compliments (being geeky/nerdy) are apparently insults to the “real” world (what’s so bad about being smart/looking smart?!).
When it comes to having doctors that just don’t work, I’m terrified of hurting their feelings and thus stay with them (that, and I don’t like looking for new doctors, either).
For example, I need a new dentist. My current dentist has big hands, and I have a small mouth. Enough said.
I need a new “regular” doctor. My current on is a pediatrician, and I despise the way she wants to handle my antidepressants. I will no longer be on cheap insurance that covers a lot next year. So my doctor’s way of dealing with this is to say that we can decrease my meds. Despite the fact that we’ve had to *increase* them within the past year. This is the same doctor who wanted to decrease my meds in the spring a couple of years ago, when I’d just *increased* them in January (she also claimed my depression was in remission. Last I knew, remission meant *not* having to increase?).
I need a new therapist, because I’m not comfortable talking to my current therapist about my problems. I categorize her as friend, and because of that, I feel I have to protect her feelings.
Once I get a regular doctor, I’ll probably need a psychiatrist to manage my antidepressants, because I don’t think “normal” doctors are allowed to do that.
Anyways, my train of thought has abruptly crashed (which it sometimes does when I’m upset :/ Usually when my mood takes a swing upwards), and thus I end this extremely pointless/mapless comment here.
heidinelle @ gmail.com if anyone wants to relate/contact me
December 21st, 2007 at 11:53 pm
Jon,
Thank you so much for sharing your experiences in living with someone with depression. I think it is hard for most people to remember that depression is a chronic illness, and that the caretakers are also at significant risk for role strain. I am so glad that you have found talk therapy helpful; I agree that we could all use it sometimes. Most of the time, really.
It can be so hard to accept that you need a medication every day just to be what we think of as “normal.” For some reason, it grates more when it’s an antidepressant than if it were insulin, for me at least. I think that you and Heather are both doing a great job at helping fight the stigma that can make us so pigheaded about it. And I, too, am guilty of going off my meds and having to have my husband check up on me. Yes, it pisses me off. Yes, I love him all the more for it when I take the meds and remember that I don’t have to feel that way.
Finally… I think Patsy’s comment about Andrea Yates is completely reprehensible. Shame on you, Patsy. Please do some research on postpartum psychosis, then some on postpartum depression, and then some on depression and anxiety. They’re quite different. And beyond that, the difference that I see that means Jon and Heather will never be in that situation? Jon gives a damn, and he and Heather have sought appropriate treatment (read: inpatient, which Mr. Yates did NOT in spite of what he knew). Leta is a beautiful little girl, who will learn a great deal about empathy and how to be a loving spouse to someone, someday, by seeing her parents’ example.
And thank you, Jon, for letting us see that example as well (and Heather too).
December 22nd, 2007 at 12:16 am
As Jane Pauley notes in the very last line of the very last page of her memoir where she discusses her bipolar disorder, “There are no charmed lives, only lives.”
You and Heather are doing a great job of living your lives together.