They Sure Do
February 21st, 2008Utah students hide guns, head to class - CNN.com
Faster. Kill. Kill. o
Tags: concealed weapons, students with guns, utah gun laws
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February 21st, 2008 at 12:22 pm
Yes. This is just what all of America needs - put guns in the hands of MORE civilians. Because clearly it’s turned out just fine so far.
February 21st, 2008 at 12:29 pm
How many shootings have occurred on Utah’s campuses?
February 21st, 2008 at 12:40 pm
An armed society is a polite society.
February 21st, 2008 at 12:53 pm
That’s a trite little response, Nobody. And untrue, to boot.
February 21st, 2008 at 1:01 pm
I have started writing about 400 different things in this spot most of which are impolite to two of the commenters above and have deleted each and every one of them. I am way, way too emotionally charged to discuss this issue with any semblance of decency. To prove how immature I would like to be regarding this issue I’ll sum it up with two words:
FUCK GUNS.
Oh my God, I can’t believe that people actually think giving people more guns will make things better. Hasn’t anyone seen the final scene of True Romance?
I jest, but seriously, it will not solve the problem. It’s like fighting cancer with cancer. Or something.
Man, I need to stop writing. This isn’t good for my heart.
February 21st, 2008 at 1:15 pm
I can only say that guns aren’t the answer but reducing a law abiding citizen’s right to protect themselves is not either. I actually applaud Utah institutions of higher learning for allowing the students to make that decision themselves.
You must remember the ones who are willing to commit crime will always have guns.
February 21st, 2008 at 1:19 pm
Ya know, it’s not like they’re handing all the students guns and saying “here, protect yourself.” They’re not forcing people to use/own/carry/like guns. There are extremely rigorous tests and checks for someone trying to earn a concealed carry license, and if a campus decides to allow them I’m all for the campus requiring tests and checks of their own on top of that. No one is “giving people more guns.” If nothing else, it is ensuring that there are more trained and responsible people carrying them.
February 21st, 2008 at 1:24 pm
Oh for the luva …more guns = not the answer.
February 21st, 2008 at 1:28 pm
The only thing I “must remember” is my social security number and my husband’s birthday.
I grew up with guns, I took all the safety courses, and I still like to shoot from time to time when I go home to visit the fam, a couple members of which own several of all types. They handle guns responsibly, and I handle guns responsibly.
Which means that none of us would carry a gun into a public place. Nothing good, and a whole host of bad can come from that.
February 21st, 2008 at 1:31 pm
Mihow,
FUCK YOU! I actually don’t really mean that but I am using it to demonstrate that as with ALL of our civil liberties (including freedom of speech), the RIGHT to BEAR arms comes with responsibility.
I know a couple who lost a child because she drowned their swimming pool. There are a LOT more guns in homes than there are pools in homes, yet more children die in swimming pools every year. FUCK SWIMMING POOLS! (More First Amendment ).
I don’t think GIVING more people guns will make things better, but I SURE as hell think that denying citizens who have EARNED that right will make things worse!
The past two most notable instances of school shootings ( VaTech and NIU) were both examples where guns were NOT permitted on campus. Did the shooter in either case care about that law?
If you had been in a classroom during Cho’s massacre and heard him making his way towards me slaughtering innocent people, would you wish he didn’t have a gun or wish that you did?
February 21st, 2008 at 1:44 pm
Ah, I see you read Freakonomics, too. :]
I seriously cannot not have this discussion online. I am not sure why I posted anything in the first place. I do apologize that I wrote what I wrote above and will quietly back out. This never ends well. It just ends up with a lot of people screaming obscenities, quoting the constitution (and assuming that the word “arms” stops at just guns.) and getting worked up.
Sorry. Continue with the gun talk. I’m disarming.
heh
February 21st, 2008 at 1:46 pm
Ummm, I seriously “cannot HAVE this discussion”. NOT “CANNOT NOT have”. That means I can have it. And I can’t. I cannot. I can’t write.
February 21st, 2008 at 1:49 pm
There was just this incident at the University of Nebraska–Lincoln yesterday with a student and a toy gun:
http://www.journalstar.com/articles/2008/02/21/news/local/doc47bcff9b6637d778596681.txt
February 21st, 2008 at 2:14 pm
Wow……pretty heavy stuff. Reminds me of the gun slinger days of the west.
This was my favorite quote: “When you see someone with a gun, you are looking at some of the most law-abiding people in the state,” he said. How about the law abiding citizen policeman that was in the news recently that elbowed his pregnant wife and then tried to conceal her death. Just because someone fits the requirements to carry a gun, doesn’t mean they fit al the requirements of being sane (especially people who can’t control their emotions and have to use the F word. Geez, how mature is that. Hope you guys don’t have gun licenses). It’s pretty scarey stuff when kids are carrying guns to school. I remember how immature I still was in college and all the bad choices I made.
February 21st, 2008 at 2:46 pm
Holy shit I am not OK with that.
Wow.
February 21st, 2008 at 3:06 pm
@Karl, the utopian gun world you want to live in doesn’t exist. Start here.
Then hit this.
p.s. Polygamists run/ran the gun store that sold one of the weapons to the guy who killed six people at the Trolley Square mall in Salt Lake City. Two kinds of Utah crazy for the price of one!
February 21st, 2008 at 4:27 pm
I am a gun owner. I am also a law abiding citizen. I went through a background check to purchase my handgun and will go through another for my conceal carry license. I hope I never am in the position where I have to draw on anyone. But to protect myself and my son I certainly will do so. Had I been on campus with my gun and taken one of these shooters out before they killed so many, you would be calling me a hero.
February 21st, 2008 at 4:28 pm
Respectfully blurb, the stories you recommend to Karl were not perpetrated by legal gun owners. Criminals with guns are not the same as legal gun owners.
February 21st, 2008 at 4:34 pm
Both of the recent (large scale) campus shooters were legal gun owners as well. They purchased their guns on the Internet.
February 21st, 2008 at 4:35 pm
Good grief. I’m a graduate student at Virginia Tech, I was here for 4/16 and all of the aftermath, and I think that allowing students to carry guns on campus is the dumbest damn idea I’ve ever heard in my life. Living in fear of getting shot is no way to live. If our gun control laws could be changed so that people with mental illness could not buy firearms, maybe we’d have a solution. Having everyone armed and under a police state is most definitely not. Improve our gun laws. Improve mental health counseling/reporting guidelines. Don’t let people pack heat to go to class. *rolls eyes*
February 21st, 2008 at 5:42 pm
I think it would be very dangerous to screen for gun ownership by way of “mental illness”. I would not trust any given test result that claims this person is “mentally fit” to own a gun. Psychological tests are far from perfect, and in the issue of a high stakes decision such as gun ownership, it would not be ethically appropriate.
February 21st, 2008 at 5:44 pm
I also wanted to add that I would have more confidence in a battery of tests that corroborate one another, but the amount of time and funds that would go into such a procedure would never fly in the real world.
February 21st, 2008 at 5:45 pm
Yes, using your concealed weapon to defend yourself and others from an asailant is a Brilliant idea. And while you are trying to gun down the gunman, your strays take out another few people. Ugh. So selfish.
February 21st, 2008 at 5:49 pm
I agree with you Lauren, and I thought that after I posted it.
However, Cho had a history of disturbing behavior that was reported by professors and other people in charge that never managed to trip off the right alarms. He was also committed for a brief time. There should have been a safe guard in the system to keep him from falling through the cracks he ended up falling through. He never should have been allowed to purchase a gun. I’m sure plenty will disagree with me.
February 21st, 2008 at 6:05 pm
I ALWAYS have a gun with me wherever I go. You just never know. *sarcasm*